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Messages - Koujiryuu

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Body Energy Arts / Re: Ask any question about Qigong or Yoga.
« on: February 05, 2016, 06:51:57 PM »
I will give my input on this.

First: My apologies guys, but grounding and centering is not traditionally a Qigong practice (or a Yoga practice) in many schools. It's more a psionic thing and even a borderline new-ager idea. Mind_Bender, I'm aware you learned this from your Bagua Shifu, but I'm unsure where he got it from. If you guys can quote me a book or link a book from a reputable Qigong author/teacher that includes grounding/centering in it, I will retract my words. To be clear, I practice mostly from Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming's books (The Root of Chinese Qigong and Qigong: The Secret of Youth) as well as Deng Dao-Ming's Scholar-Warrior. I also have Opening the Energy Gates of Your Body by Bruce Frantzis as well as Empty Force by Paul Dong. All of these have numerous Qigong sets and some go really in depth into Qigong theory (The Root) and none of them include grounding and centering as an exercise.

Second, Steve is right, Qi balls serve no real purpose at best and are counterproductive to Qi development at worst. My approach nowadays is that hey, if people wanna make Qi balls, let them! However, in my practice and from people I've talked to (e.g. mystic, Kendamu) Qi balls would be essentially wasting your energy. The approach is to conserve, conserve. This means (usually) abstinence from sex, proper diet and so on. It is far more productive to practice the Microcosmic Orbit and other circulations than to make Qi balls (which theoretically dissipate the Qi, but as Mind_Bender mentioned I'm unsure if that's true).

Lakshmi, if you want to practice Qi balls I would start first with the Dantian meditation found here in my Qigong study group: Dantian meditation Practice that for a week and cultivate an "empty" mindset. We don't want to force our Qi into balls in our hands and we don't want to visualize or imagine Qi gathering in the Dantian. That is a "filling" method and is detrimental to development. Instead, simply empty the mind with a focus on the Dantian and breathe, and your body will do the rest. This is an "emptying" method of meditation.

After this I would move on to the "Bringing Qi to the Hands" (Exercise 6) exercise found here. This is essentially Dantian meditation, but with a focus on the hands. This will bring Qi to the hands simply by thought as opposed to forceful methods, or visualization of energy balls.

I hope this helps. Regards.

EDIT: To make things clear for anyone else if I'm not around, I would strongly urge people to practice the methods and curriculum in my Qigong Study Group course as opposed to the methods in my articles (especially Beginning Daoist Qigong). Please refer anyone wishing to learn Qigong to the study group material, as it's far superior and not 12 years old.

Hello and Goodbye / Re: Hello everybody! I'm Nativewolfie!
« on: February 02, 2016, 07:06:53 PM »
Hello nativewolfie. Welcome to the forums. Have a welcome cow!  :cow:

I didn't look at all your videos, but I did look at one in particular that interested me: Tao Teh Ching.

Your video was interesting, to say the least.

If you are interested in Daoism and the Tao Teh Ching (Daodejing) I would recommend you read this translation of it: S. Mitchell translation

You are right around my age when I began practicing Daoism, and I am 31 now.

I would also urge you to spend less time practicing "energy work" with other people you find, and making videos about stuff, and more time in solitary meditation. You seem quite hyperactive and I would suggest you spend a lot of time doing simple meditation.

This article is a very good introduction to simple meditation and you can also try the exercises found in my article here.

Good health and training.


Hello and Goodbye / Re: Yeah...
« on: February 02, 2016, 02:46:40 AM »
Not very good lately, unfortunately. I'll spare you the details. But you can probably guess it's the usual stuff. I'm crazy, after all.  :P

Still into the gaming, computers, and all that stuff. Got a new TV. Got a PS Vita.

Getting acupuncture and resuming regular meditation (I've always been an on-and-off practitioner: I go through phases). Been drinking tea all the time again and really enjoying it. The meditation is less for anything esoteric and more for health and peace of mind. As I've gotten older I've started to understand karma better. So, I rarely, if ever, practice any sort of "direct magick" or application of will on my environment or on others. Not even stuff like Qi healing. I feel lately like messing with anything at all is against my philosophy. Imposing my will on anyone else just brings me bad karma. So yeah, I keep the meditation simple and do it to help myself feel better (I have severe depression.)

How are things with you? Still doing the 3D rendering? I don't know how to do any of that stuff but it's interesting to me. The stuff you made was pretty cool.

Body Energy Arts / Re: Empty Force - Kong Jing
« on: February 02, 2016, 02:36:54 AM »
That's an interesting explanation. My (now defunct) Sifu told me that Jing is just Jin with a 'g' at the end. Maybe I missed something?

Are you saying that Jing is a something, or a place of sorts (lower Dan Ti'en for example) and Jin is the method of power? In other words, Jin is to Jing as Yi is to Shen?

My current teacher doesn't talk about any of the lingo, we just do our form and apply each Gua with a partner to understand what we should be focusing on. He's all about relaxation (which is awesome!).

Good to see you around Koujiryuu, even if we had some heated words in the past!  :)

What you said essentially sums it up. Yes, Jing is tangible, it is the sexual energy, and it is also a place. Jin is the method of applying Jing. But where it gets complicated is that this also naturally involves Qi. You cannot work with Jing (essence) or Jin (power) without working with Qi- breath; in the literal sense. This is one thing some people miss, it's something you learn early but forget. Qi is not just energy but also breath, and this is VERY important for Jin. At this point it also strongly involves Yi; Yi is mostly related to Shen, correct, but it is also strongly linked to Qi. You cannot do anything with Qi without intention; likewise with Jin and Jing. If you have strong enough Yi you can transform Jing to Qi and vice versa; you can also invoke the kundalini, or Xi Shui Jing, and begin the alchemical process of turning Jing, to Qi, to Shen, to Void (nothingness). So yes, you could say Jin is to Jing as Yi is to Shen, but you could also say a lot of other similar statements and probably be correct. I think mentioned this once but at some point, they all seem to merge together. You can theorize and explain and talk about it all you want but the reality is that it's worthless unless you DO IT. What you're doing now with your teacher seems like it's about right. And yes, relaxation is totally key and probably why I like lying meditation (lying down) more than anything else. Hope this all makes sense.

To elaborate, it's actually a little more complex than that (Jin and Jing), though, when you factor in things like Yuan Qi (original or Pre-Natal Qi), Yuan Jing (original Jing) and so on. Basically, the goal as I understand it is to merge and reunify all these separate forces in the Lower Dantien. As I said, this happens through meditation, your Qigong forms (sinking the weight) and especially the Microcosmic Orbit. Most people, and most internal stylists seem to get to the point of having sunk the Post-Natal Qi to the Lower Dantien (the Qi from air and food), where it gathers with Original Pre-Natal Qi (Qi from the mother/fetus). Then, if they are lucky they gain some ability to direct Qi. They may also build Jin (internal power). But they never learn the method to transform Qi to Jing, and they might not even open their vessels, especially conception (renmei). The kundalini process can take a lot of time and it takes hard work, it took me 1 month of meditation and yoga 6 hours a day. Yes, I know it's short, but it felt like it was "meant" to happen when it did. (Prior to that I was still doing around 3 hours a day training for a year.) Most people don't have this time and most teachers themselves don't even have it. It was only after a lot of research that what I had done with the kundalini process was basically Xi Shui Jing to the Daoists. And in theory, this means unification of Original Qi, Original Jing, Post Natal Qi, Post Natal Jing rising up the spine to the upper Dantien to reunify with Shen. I kind of doubt that any Tai Chi or Ba Gua teacher would be able to explain this stuff, let alone teach someone to do it. I was only able to figure it out from a Daoist context after much research. So anyway, it seems like they may be able to develop Jin and Qi but kind of miss the Jing and Shen part altogether.

I could say more if it interests you, about what I feel in meditation and my experiences and so on, but I don't want to seem like I'm rambling. I started to write about it but then thought it sounded kind of crazy, delusional, egotistical etc. so I stopped.

I don't recall any heated words with you. It must have been 2 or 3 years ago now. Water under the bridge. And I totally respect your experience (I wish I had a Bagua teacher here!)

Hello and Goodbye / Yeah...
« on: February 02, 2016, 12:31:50 AM »
I might be posting a little bit for a while.

I don't know when I'll get sick of it, or get angry and leave again.

Lots of new faces here.  :eek:

Hope to at least help out a little bit and not get too flustered.

Good to be here.



Main Hall / Re: Since I've returned to "the community"
« on: February 02, 2016, 12:24:21 AM »
I would say this is all basically absolute bullshit. And that goes for both of you. (Redd and Magari)

Reread your post and check yourself when you complain about people being poor, uneducated, etc. and how humanity and mystics have made no progress. Look at your own attitude and how you are looking down on others because they are not "initiated" and in your eyes, not good enough for you. Wouldn't this basically be an admission of your own elitism and bitterness? Does this sound like it's coming from someone who has made any spiritual progress or has any insight?

I'm sorry, but there's plenty of people who are spiritual, and who practice, but have learned mostly from books and have never taken a class (myself included). There are traditions and practices that don't have fruity ritualistic "initiation" processes. Some of these traditions (meditative Yoga and Qigong/Taoist alchemy) are obscure or hard to find instruction in, in the west. Does that mean you can't learn from books and practice? Shouldn't the gauge of whether someone is genuine or not be based not on if they received initiation, but rather based on their sincerity in practice, or the achievements they've made? I've practiced Qigong, Yoga and meditation for 18 years now, and for 15 of those with the kundalini, learning mostly from books and videos. But according to you, since I haven't been "initiated" I don't know anything at all and haven't made any progress?

Further, you complain about contributing to society or contributing to mysticism, where is your contribution? The website in your sig? My contribution to Veritas is in my signature, and some of those things go back to 2004. So why are you coming to this community and complaining if you are not going to contribute?

Maybe it's something with your ego, and jealously vs Veritas, how long it's been around and your small time website. I don't really know.

If you don't want to contribute here and you think everyone is not good enough, and that we're all role playing, then just leave  :teethy:

Modo Magi website: 200 Posts in 62 Topics by 41 Members.

The Veritas Society: 211399 Posts in 15624 Topics by 16273 Members.

I think that about says it all  :HA!:

Body Energy Arts / Re: Empty Force - Kong Jing
« on: February 01, 2016, 11:31:49 PM »
I'm just gonna duck in and say not to rule out Jing (essence) completely. Shinichi, it seems like you really want to prove that Jing and Jin are separate and different (they are), but it sounds to me like you are missing some key parts.

In the books that I've studied, and from people I've talked to there is an undeniable link between Jing and Jin (internal power).

This is something that has to be understood from the paradigm of the text "Secret of the Golden Flower" and Dr. Yang Jwing Ming's interpretation of small heavenly circulation (Microcosmic Orbit) and the three Dantien.

A big part of developing Jin, and strengthening the original Jing (Yuan Jing or Neijing) comes from sinking the Post-Birth Qi (in the middle Dantien) to the Lower Dantien. This is accomplished through Qigong, Zhan Zhuang, Microcosmic Orbit and lowering the center of gravity. When this happens, then the Post-Birth Qi (firey Qi, from air and food) is unified with the Original Qi and Original Jing in the lower Dantien. The conception channel (renmei) is opened. After some time, if practice continues (particularly the Microcosmic Orbit) then the Qi and Jing in the lower Dantien moves up the Through-Going Vessel (Chongmei; spinal cord) to nourish the brain. This process is called Xi Shui Jing. It is Brain/Marrow Washing. You can find more details in "Qigong: The Secret of Youth" by Dr. Jwing-Ming. This process is basically kundalini awakening.

My point, is that by starting the circuit and opening the vessels in this manner, you are also sinking the body weight and developing Jin (internal power). This cannot happen without Jing and it cannot be developed to a high level without having the vessels opened. Qi leads Jing and Jing gives birth to Jin. At this point, you develop a very strong, sticky, magnetic flow of energy in the spinal cord. This is undeniably Qi but it is Jing too, and at the same time Jin.

The Jin is basically the action, and you are correct in saying it is body mechanics and intention (Yi). These are the different types of Jin in Taiji and Bagua. I'm just trying to elaborate, however, that Jing (essence) is involved in the process too. This comes from the unification of the San Bao (three treasures) manifesting in the spinal cord. You are basically not only using Jin, internal power, in combat but also applying your Qi and your sexual energy, and this comes from the lowered center of gravity. I hope that doesn't sound too crazy or anything. Also, you can see this in the stance of strong fighters, the back arches and the spine makes a C. Watch Bruce Lee-san in action to see this. He is manifesting his energy up the spine and down the arms. The Jin comes from the lower body = lower Dantien = essence

I hope I'm making sense and this gets through. It's something that is quite difficult to put into words and I think it is also something that is almost useless to explain if the other person hasn't had the experience (e.g. kundalini).

I would also like to remind you of this post and your replies to it. Something to keep in mind.

I hope I was able to add to the conversation positively. If anyone has any questions or wants my interpretation of things, I will continue to check the forums for a few days to respond.

Good health and training.

Spirituality / Re: Why seek enlightenment?
« on: February 01, 2016, 10:38:43 PM »
Or maybe you've already escaped and you just don't realize it?

Spirituality / Re: Why seek enlightenment?
« on: February 01, 2016, 09:35:10 PM »
That is a most excellent interpretation, for sure.

Very nice to read and think about.

Spirituality / Re: Why seek enlightenment?
« on: February 01, 2016, 09:23:37 PM »
Enlightenment is not what it appears to be. You can't say anything about it and try to define it without basically being incorrect. It's similar to trying to explain Zen in concrete language. If you do, you miss the point.

"Those who know don't talk, those who talk don't know." <- this is also pretty much the same thing.

It's about taking action and becoming something as opposed to talking about it.

It could also mean that if you see someone claiming to be enlightened, kill him (ignore him, be wary of him) because anyone who would claim such is probably not really enlightened.

That's my interpretation of the quote; but my interpretation means nothing.

What is more important, is what does the quote mean to YOU, freeDspirit?

P.S. please also enjoy this site as well as Siji Tzu. Both these sites deal pretty heavily with the subject of enlightenment.

Spirituality / Re: Why seek enlightenment?
« on: February 01, 2016, 08:36:04 PM »
Quote from: Zen koan
If you see the Buddha on the road, kill him.

Quote from: U.G. Krishnamurti
     I am not out to liberate anybody. You have to liberate yourself, and you are unable to do that. What I have to say will not do it. I am only interested in describing this state, in clearing away the occultation and mystification in which those people in the 'holy business' have shrouded the whole thing. Maybe I can convince you not to waste a lot of time and energy, looking for a state which does not exist except in your imagination.


    Get this straight, this is your state I am describing, your natural state, not my state or the state of a God-realized man or a mutant or any such thing. This is your natural state, but what prevents what is there from expressing itself in its own way is your reaching out for something, trying to be something other than what you are.


    You can never understand this; you can only experience this in terms of your past experience. This is outside the realm of experience. The natural state is acausal: it just happens. No communication is possible, and none necessary. The only thing that is real to you is the way you are functioning; it is an act of futility to relate my description to the way you are functioning. When you stop all this comparison, what is there is your natural state. Then you will not listen to anybody.


This state is a physical condition of your being. It is not some kind of psychological mutation. It is not a state of mind into which you can fall one day, and out of it the next day. You can't imagine the extent to which, as you are now, thought pervades and interferes with the functioning of every cell in your body. Coming into your natural state will blast every cell, every gland, every nerve. It is a chemical change. An alchemy of some sort takes place. But this state has nothing to do with the experiences of chemical drugs such as LSD. Those are experiences; this is not.


Does such a thing as enlightenment exist? To me what does exist is a purely physical process; there is nothing mystical or spiritual about it. If I close the eyes, some light penetrates through the eyelids. If I cover the eyelids, there is still light inside. There seems to be some kind of a hole in the forehead, which doesn't show, but through which something penetrates. In India that light is golden; in Europe it is blue. There is also some kind of light penetration through the back of the neck. It's as if there is a hole running through between those spots in front and back of the skull. There is nothing inside but this light. If you cover those points, there is complete, total darkness. This light doesn't do anything or help the body to function in any way; it's just there.


And now a quote from me:

"The secret of the universe is that there is no secret.

The secret of the Dao is that there is no Dao."

There is no such thing as enlightenment. And anyone claiming to be enlightened shouldn't be teaching anything.

There's my contribution; I hope you find it useful.


This is my first post in a year and a half. Apologies for not reading the thread in it's entirety, this is all news to me, the blog is news to me, and I'm playing catch up.

No, I am not returning to Veritas for the long haul. I doubt the staff would want that anyway.

I was removed from the school (TDS) recently, supposedly because the website was restructured and all the old accounts were pruned. This is despite Ramose telling me I would remain in the school in case I wanted to resume the course. But prior to that, I had lost the ability to chat in the general chat (on the bottom right of the TDS site) a month or two after finishing my Probationer class. I also sent numerous PMs to the teachers with questions about the practices, and was ignored. I rocked the boat a bit in my Probationer course, and questioned the practices and beliefs of the group.

I've been a vocal opponent of the school and the way it functions for years now. This is evident by the things I said in the Prophecy and Veos thread. I still can't prove (or believe) all the stories about meeting hidden masters, traveling to India and all that stuff. There's just no evidence. I was writing articles with Prophecy in 2004. Further, I've seen The Underground Dragon, forcecraft, elemental magick classes held here by Prophecy, and so on. All that stuff was basically made up by Ramose and Veos. So why would TDS be any different? That's the question I cannot resolve. Unless I could talk directly with the people who taught them, the guru they followed and so on, or see other evidence of similar practices, I won't be convinced.

I could write volumes on why even the most basic practices of the school (e.g. VoA) blatantly ignore basic meditative principles. I can explain how they contradict Qigong as I've learned it. I could even explain why the VoA is taught improperly because before you learn it, you aren't taught basic things like HOW to sense and move energy or HOW to breathe properly. I could also probably write volumes on the philosophy in the lectures you learn, and how it's detrimental to spiritual development and just serves to overcomplicate and confuse practitioners. Less is more. I practice the Dao and Zen, and for those, you really don't need "lectures". So the TDS practices and philosophy are pretty much the antithesis of what I practice, which is why I didn't continue on with the school.

It is good that more attention is being given to them, and people are speaking out, because the practices are (potentially) dangerous, and some of the other advice is dangerous too (telling schizophrenics not to take their meds, hell they even told ME not to take my meds, and there's plenty of people here who know me well and know why I absolutely must take them.)

Other than that, hope everyone else is in good health and spirits. Take it easy.


Body Energy Arts / Re: Energy Problems
« on: June 16, 2014, 07:00:36 PM »
Quote from: Koujiryuu
There are 65000 different forms of delusion, according to Buddhism. Now don't sit there and say, "Kouji's an asshole and calling us deluded", because I'm not. Be honest with yourself, both of you. And really take that in and think about it. 65,000 different forms of delusion... and sometimes it's even said that each one is a separate "hell".

Anything can be a delusion, you can be deluded and not even know it. Perhaps the true light, and goodness is just a delusion. Just kidding. But no really, it is. Ultimately, there is no light, there is no Dao. The light is an illusion. However, how am I to live my life? Am I purposely going to cause suffering, and hurt others? What do I stand to gain from that? Even hurting my enemies, would be a shame, and would go against what I believe. So even though there really is no good or evil, no light or darkness, if I have to choose a way to live my life, I am going to help others and try and bring them joy and light.

That is where we differ, Rayn. I see no difference between a "magical obsession" or a delusion, that's just semantics. I understand that an obsession can be used to give you power, but that's not what I care about. What use do I have of power? Why would I find joy in manipulating my fellow man? I am not deluded, and I know my own personal truth. This is all just a big stage, and we are all actors. However, it is what it is, and so I decided I will live my life and try and do good and be the best person I can be, and help others. This is obviously in direct contention with your personal philosophy and practices. But that's okay, different strokes for different folks. Honestly, I just feel bad for you, something very bad must have happened to you to make you this way. I know you don't want or need my pity, ultimately what matters is if you're happy with yourself. But I don't understand why you would purposely want to manipulate others, be in league with demons, or whatever else you do.

Body Energy Arts / Re: Energy Problems
« on: June 16, 2014, 06:48:44 PM »

You should get a cow for that post  :cow:

Excellently written and I agree wholeheartedly with everything you posted.

To go into a Vedantic perspective, I'd only ask who defines light and dark? Mind. What defines emotionality and even allegory of what is right and what is wrong? Mind.

Above everything else, understand that the mind drives so much of this life. And while different schools have different points of emphasis, the draw is the same. To let go of the mind to understand who you truly are. The true self, a child of the path.

If anyone wants to cling to this notion of conceptuality to assuage ego that's fine. Ego is a great thing because it keeps us tethered to the world. But you don't get far on conceptuality mental construction.

Everything is mind. It's really that simple. Ultimately though, even mind doesn't exist. The only thing that never changes is Dao.  :wink:

No need for attachment.

Body Energy Arts / Re: Energy Problems
« on: June 16, 2014, 06:29:31 PM »
Quote from: Rayn
I'm not going to give you some long condescending lecture, but I will say that what people call energy follows our thoughts, intentions, experiences, and emotions, so, yes, it is possible for energy to be more destructive when a person is becoming more destructive, themselves. I actually experience something similar, myself; however, that is because I have a side of me that is quite masochistic and sadistic which, in turn, colors my "aura". By this, what I mean is that I throw off emanations of that particular type. Feelings can be correlated with emotions which are correlated with "energy"; therefore, it is possible for your emotions to be causing physical pain where it also manifests as physically or non-physically destructive actions. The root cause; however, would not be your energy; rather, the root cause would be your state of mind.

Due to the physiology of sensations and the physiology of emotions, an emotion can cause a sensation to be interpreted by the brain stem as painful; therefore, when you experience emotional upheaval, you can feel pain, so, technically, the pain is not all in your head; however, it would be caused by your emotions.

Quote from: Rayn
I have to disagree with you. Desires, intentions, beliefs, and expectations are extensions of ourselves where you can say this gives properties to what you call energy; therefore, if a person has a desire to be dark, there is a dark part of them which, in turn, gives energy associated with that mental content those properties. For example, if I have a desire to hurt someone maliciously, that desire is an extension of myself where metaphysical workings will those have those properties. I'm a pretty dark person, myself, where this darkness can emanate from me and be quite saturating and very destructive. The energy a person has is extrinsic to them; therefore, if you have a dark person, it is reasonable to think that their energy is dark. If you have a destructive person, the same holds true. I can have a dark, destructive, malicious aura where I am a dark person where, in this instance, I am a sadists.

Yeah, so what you're saying is:

Quote from: Buddha
You are what you think, having become what you thought.

Notice I made mention of what proper spiritual teaching is, among many traditions, as well as saying it's just a "dark side", or perhaps a manifestation of delusion (e.g. feeling you're special because you have a dark side).

If you really read what I'm saying and take it in, I'm essentially saying that yeah, a dark side and dark energy exists. I never said it didn't. I'm just saying it's not something special, and it isn't a problem unless you let it influence your actions and your mind. It's just not wise to follow that side or give in to it. Instead of feeling your energy out and feeling a dark side of it, and seeing dark blue... instead, try and look inside and find the light, the goodness in you, and spread that into the world. That's what I'm about and what I do. That's essentially what mystic does, and that's also essentially what you'll learn at The Divine Science. This is what Buddhism teaches, and what Daoism teaches, and what a good Hindu Guru would teach you. It's basically what Christianity is about, even if that light comes from Jesus instead. There is no need to make it so complex, or dwell on a dark side, or dark energy. There is an alternative, you just need to look inside and find it. This might sound corny, or too optimistic, and it might be hard for you to understand Rayn, but I truly believe that's what the problem is.

Quote from: RanmaBushiko
On a different note, Koujiryuu, I HAVE seen authentic "dark sides" before a few times.  However, most of the ones I saw were either artificial in nature from trying experiments, or were past life aspects to their personality that "reawoke" when they did some training in that field.

Again, "you are what you think having become what you thought". If you focus on the dark side, that's what you'll find. If you focus on the good side, and the light, that's what you'll find. But oftentimes our minds attach to something that isn't real, and recognizing that can be difficult. Ultimately, in the end, none of it is real anyway. The light isn't even real.

Quote from: ShadowFinch
I'm still in the process of looking through my notebooks to find which had the drawings in it. The one symbol that really stuck out at me that I KNOW I haven't seen before, I started drawing during my junior or senior year of high school (I finished my first year of college this year) so it may take a bit more digging to find it among my endless supply of notebooks. The other symbols are drawn in a notebook somewhere among all the stuff I brought home from college, which admittedly I still haven't taken care of. That one should be easier to find though and I will have some pictures uploaded soon. I actually put those in a separate notebook from my school ones because I didn't want anyone finding them. Knowing my roommate, she would have probably freaked out, called me a devil worshiper, and demanded I move out of the room.

I will look at the suggestions for energy manipulation help. And DN was right, I started doing things purely out of my own curiosity. There was a site that had briefly touched on the idea of energy manipulation but all it showed how to do was make an energy ball. After I learned how to do that, I started just trying things on my own. "Ok, this is how I make an energy ball. This is what it feels like. What else can I do with the energy? Well, something else just happened. I don't know what it is, but I know that when I do this, it feels like this." And that's basically how I've been doing all of it.

As far as the  "stupor", it usually occurs once I try the connection thing. I've found out that if I can look into a person's eyes, I can usually connect to them somehow. As they say, "the eyes are the window to the soul". I've just started experimenting with this very recently. But I've found that once I try connecting to them, I get this feeling almost as if I'm being pulled into them - like I'm disconnecting from my own body and being drawn into theirs or something. However, when I try to stop, sometimes it feels like I get lost somewhere between my body and theirs. Hence the stupor. It feels like I'm not even really in my body, almost like I'm somewhere on the outside and it's hard for me to get back in. Again, I've had no training. I don't know what it's called, I just go off of what happens and what I feel. I used the pain once or twice because even when I was back "in" my body, I didn't feel like I was completely there. It still sort of felt like part of me was lingering somewhere else.

Also, as far as the "bad side" I just don't understand it because it's so not like me. I'm the kind of person that doesn't like evil or violence. The "dark sides" that people always talk about are completely against my nature.

If you upload pictures of the drawings, I'm sure myself and others can help you with them. Rayn in particular is VERY good at that stuff.

Energy balls, that's most people's starting point. My methods don't use it. But that's okay. I suggest you look into kobok's Dynamic Psi material and try practicing that. I suggest reading this article in particular, and make note of the "use of hands" section.

A bit of advice, what you want to be doing is trying to empty yourself and clear your mind of thoughts. This will allow you to feel your true soul. Unclouded by judgement or delusion. If you do this right, I can almost guarantee you won't feel any "dark energy".

The eyes are very important in the tradition of Yoga, they are important in Daoism as well. It's said that some Gurus can give shaktipat just through a look. I have experimented with the eyes before. What I don't understand, is why you want to be connecting to other people. Don't worry about other people, worry about yourself first. E.g. "Knowing others is intelligence. Knowing yourself is true wisdom." Lao Tzu Especially if you are just beginning practice, learning yourself is more important. Oftentimes, we come across sides of ourselves we don't like. Everyone has a dark side. The point of spiritual practice is to learn this, and overcome it, and find the divine light.

If it isn't already clear to you, I will make it very clear to you. I apologize in advance if this comes off as condescending, that's not my intention. Energy manipulation is not just something you do because it's fun. It's not a game. Meditation is a very serious thing, that will allow you to experience your soul, and move beyond the physical body. This is why I talk about the light, and bringing light into the world. Many people become sidetracked, and turn crooked in the process, and damage their spirits, and create bad karma. Energy work is using your life force, your very soul itself. There are consequences to every action. I hope that you can confront your dark side, the dark energy, and conquer it, and find light and love in the process. I'm worried about you, and I'm not lying when I say I care. I suggest you meditate and contemplate deeply on the subject, and find a way to find the true goodness. That's what you want to find. That's what this is all about.

Quote from: DecayingNecropolis
I apologize Kouji, I did not mean to imply you were being an asshole, it was just the general impression I got from the group response at the time. Though I'll admit, that is a very interesting way of looking at it, I mean about there being 65,000 types of delusions and each being a separate form of "hell". And I did not know you were practicing Daoists, that's something that interests me very much that I'd like to look more into actually.

Though, as I stated, or rather meant to state by that comment about taking it as trolling, I did realize it could come off that way, being familiar with online energy communities myself since I was 15, and being 23 now. I understand that point of view well enough. But do bear in mind, she didn't come here by her decision alone, she came to me looking for help, and I recommended we try a forum together so we could get the problem sorted out. This one stuck out in my mind and its been a while since I've tried to do much of anything here, but I do like what this community stands for, truth. So I can guarantee you, her intentions were not to stand out in an online community, since I recommended she come her and she told me about this much earlier on, I do also know her in real life. I've seen it plenty of times myself, though with her, I do believe she is being sincere, maybe I am biased because we are close friends, but I don't see anything to be gained from telling me about this, other than some form of positive solution.

You didn't really imply I was being an asshole, I just don't think you appreciated where I'm coming from until now. I'm the one who said I'm an ass, and a lot of the time it's largely true. I don't believe in sugarcoating things, and I tell the truth. Everything is created by mind. If you feel and experience a dark energy, try and reach inside yourself and find a good energy instead. That's what that Buddha quote means, or at least one interpretation of it.

I didn't see you or Finch as trolling at all. I've just seen people with this problem before, numerous times, and every time I saw it it was an attachment of the mind. That's all. Sometimes you just need to hear the hard truth, without any bullshit.

I'm sure she didn't want to stand out, and it's a cry for help. Well, I'm here to help, and so is everyone else. My take on it is yeah, you're looking for the wrong thing, and that's what you're finding.

As far as Daoism, yeah. The best thing to do would be to go read this if you're interested.

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