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Academic Areas => Articles => Psi and Mental Abilities => Topic started by: kobok on December 27, 2004, 04:04:28 AM

Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on December 27, 2004, 04:04:28 AM
Focal Meditation

The role of focal meditation in psi

Meditation is central to the practice of psi.  Gaining meaningful control over your psi abilities will only come through steady and regular meditation.

There are two major classes of meditation, void meditation and focal meditation.  Void meditation is an extended blanking of the mind, in which one attempts to have no thought and no awareness in order to clear one's mind and open oneself up to new understanding.  Focal meditation is a deep concentration of the mind, in which one attempts to focus all thought and awareness on a single thing, either an object or a concept.

For the purposes of psi, focal meditation is the form of meditation which is of primary interest.  A psion uses focal meditation to gain the depth of inner self-control necessary to achieve clarity in the sensing abilities and control over the kinetic abilities.

It's certainly possible to perform a psionic act without any meditation.  It's even possible to perform a psionic act completely by accident.  But any would-be psion who wishes to gain consistent and deep control of the psi abilities must use focal meditation to achieve this.

The most basic focal meditation is simply to select an object and stare at that object, focusing all of your thoughts and awareness on that object.  Any object will do for this; it can be as simple as a spot on the wall or a dot drawn on paper.  The best objects to select are the ones which help to draw your attention.  One example of an object which does this for many people would be a crystal.  However, the best object for focal meditation in psi seems to be the candle flame.


Candle meditation

The following exercise will be described in terms of a candle flame.  If you at all can, you should seek out a candle and perform this with an actual candle flame, as the flame does an excellent job of drawing your attention and preparing you for later work in psi.  If you are unable to do this, substitute the flame in the following description for the focal object of your choice.

Take a candle into a dark quiet room, and place it somewhere free of clutter so you do not become easily distracted while meditating.  Light the candle, and then sit comfortably one or two meters away from the candle.

Relax your body and mind as much as you can, and watch the candle flame.  Do not strain your eyes while focusing on the candle flame, as the focusing you will be doing is in your mind, not in your eyes.  Clear all of your thoughts, and focus them only on the flame.  When thoughts come to your mind, be passive toward your thoughts, allowing them to pass over you and through you, but do not acknowledge the thoughts.  Keep the entirety of your awareness only on the candle flame.

Continue to focus on the candle flame for around 45-60 minutes consecutively.  If you find yourself distracted and losing focus, simply correct your focus and awareness back to the candle flame, and continue your practice.  With practice, focal meditation will become easier, and you will be able to reach deep meditative states much more quickly.


Deep meditation

After meditating with complete focus on the candle flame for a while, you will begin to enter deeper meditative states.  At first focal meditation will simply lead you toward a calm and quiet state, followed later by a deeper collected focus.  When your focus becomes more complete and you enter deeper meditative states, you will begin to experience tingling, buzzing, or vibrating sensations, which will also be followed by feelings of detachment.  When these sensations occur, do not be frightened by them, but instead accept these sensations and welcome them.  Allow those sensation to grow stronger as you fall into deeper and deeper meditative states.


Relaxing after meditation

When you have finished meditating, you should try to gradually return yourself to a normal state of mind.  First begin by relaxing your mind, so that other thoughts can enter.  Then you should calmly and slowly breathe in and out, and as you breathe in bring your awareness inward, and as you breathe out flush your awareness out, taking any excess energy with you down into the ground.  When you have finished breathing in and out a few times like this, return your awareness to your normal surroundings and go about the rest of your day.


The added benefits of focal meditation

Psions use focal meditation to learn mastery of psi, but the benefits of focal meditation can flow throughout much of the psion's life.  Regular practice of focal meditation yields greater mental focus in other cognitive activities.  It also teaches greater mental discipline and self-control when facing daily struggles.  Focal meditation brings a depth of confidence and awareness about the self which enhances interaction with others.  And finally, focal meditation is the beginning of the psi philosophy that changing something in the external world always begins by first changing something within oneself.
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Adept on December 28, 2004, 07:02:18 PM
This type of medatation is also helpful for the magician isnt it?
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Prophecy on December 29, 2004, 08:37:12 PM
Meditation is helpful for anyone, with few exceptions.
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: vashts on December 30, 2004, 06:53:38 AM
So what is void meditation good for?
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Falcon on January 17, 2005, 06:21:29 AM
Did you know if you perform void meditation you don't need as much sleep at night because your mind is resting.

I liked it kobok keep up the good work.
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Oracle on February 06, 2005, 10:50:03 AM
excellent Kobok, great article, once again, my stock of Advil dropped dramatically, but it was a good article.
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: psychicpenguin on March 22, 2005, 04:19:20 PM
Great, Kobok! Found it really useful. Maybe someone could write an article or start a thread suggesting some good places to meditate or how to find good places to meditate?
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Odisirus on May 15, 2005, 07:24:46 PM
Very interesting. it's wierd though, once, i was focusing on the psiwheel, and i found i had slipped into deep meditation with out much trying, though when i realized this, i slipped out and lost focus
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Fortitudo Dei on May 23, 2005, 06:08:45 PM
If a flame hurts your eyes, can the use of a mandala be a substitute?
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on May 25, 2005, 12:24:06 PM
Quote from: Silver_Haze
If a flame hurts your eyes, can the use of a mandala be a substitute?


If the flame hurts your eyes, you're probably sitting too close.  Sit back farther.  This exercise should put no strain on your eyes, as the focus is in your mind, not in your eye.
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Iavas on May 28, 2005, 09:29:49 PM
I think what Silver_Haze means is the same effect you get at staring at the sun. When you stare at any source of light for a long time, focusing your eyes or not, the photoreceptive cone cells in the back of your eyes are bombarded with energy, producing the negative image "burned into your eyes" that lasts for a while after you stop staring. It could also make your eyes feel really tired, even if they were unfocused.

Now, what I'm interested in, is void meditation. Does it really help your mind rest faster, thus decreasing optimal sleep time?
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: Rawiri on June 09, 2005, 02:38:50 AM
Yes, void meditation can do this, but it is not being at the void state itself that does this, it is getting there. Throughout everyday you are bombarded with thoughts, a few of these you pay attention to and all the rest are "stacked away" on shelves.

Now usually through sleep your mind looks at all these thoughts, but there are still alot that are not looked at usually and tese build up. Before one can properly reach a void state, without blatantly ignoring all thoughts, which I have found just to create troubles and annoyance with meditation full stop. One has to watch one's thoughts and allow the "shelves" to be emptied, so to speak, then, once your mind has looked at all the thoughts, a sudden clamness will overcome you.

Now when in this calmness, your mind can truly rest, no need to organize thoughts etc, along with this, when you sleep your mind will have less thoughts to overlook, so can spend more time actually resting.
Title: Focal Meditation
Post by: ABustedWatch on June 23, 2005, 01:18:50 PM
Excellent article. So simply stated, yet the effort is quite a bit involved. I thought I had good focal meditation, but I will continue my practicing.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: SleepWalker on July 13, 2005, 07:21:14 PM
Very nice I feel I've seen it before, but written differently
void meditation has beneficial effects also does it not?
focusing on nothing is much the same as focusing on something correct?
One is assumed more difficult perhaps?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kakkarot on July 15, 2005, 05:52:39 PM
Um, one is assumed more impossible. You don't focus on nothing in void meditation, you empty yourself and become nothing.

~kakkarot
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: SleepWalker on July 17, 2005, 06:41:29 AM
you merely edited my words into your perspective, void meditation, focusing on not focusing, in an effort to become free of thought.
the process is not impossible,
the void state would prove rather near impossible though to attain.
If you were to focus on all things would your focus be on that of the void?
What is your understanding of the term void?
Does void not contain all things and none at the same time?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kakkarot on July 18, 2005, 05:47:43 AM
Void is empty. Void meditation isn't "meditating on nothing", it isn't "focusing on the void while you meditate", it isn't "focus on not focusing". It is letting go of all those things and everything else to simply *be* empty rather than /think/ empty. Difference between thinking and doing: in your mind think about lifting your arm, and then let go of that thought and actually lift your arm instead of just thinking about lifting your arm.

It's like having a glass full of oil, and trying to empty the glass by pouring in water (because oil will rise above water and eventually flow over the edges if you add enough water); you now have a clearer and more fluid substance in the glass, but the glass is not empty. To empty the glass, you tip it over and remove as much substance as possible from within it and leave it tipped over for the water droplets on the inside of the glass to eventually leave as well.

~kakkarot
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Sekhmet on July 19, 2005, 03:47:36 PM
so what do you do about fear of starting a fire? the author didn't cover this.

that fear is actually quite distracting. what I tried was a black construction paper set-up with a white star on it. for focusing that is. then I got all twitchy.

you can't do meditations like this outside in nature either unless you have a nice hard surface of concrete to do it in.

just a thought.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on July 20, 2005, 09:13:44 AM
so what do you do about fear of starting a fire? the author didn't cover this.


Avoid doing it around flammable objects?  Candles are safe if placed in non-flammable locations.  Observe the same safety precautions you would anytime you use a candle.

Beyond that, your focus should be on the candle flame itself, not on fears.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Sekhmet on July 20, 2005, 05:58:51 PM
and this is something I do more or less with a great deal of water standing by, a nice glass chalice, and very deep candle holders, tea lights are dangerous.

but yes, the fear of starting a fire.

well off to meditate now.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: SleepWalker on July 26, 2005, 07:20:09 PM
Void is empty. Void meditation isn't "meditating on nothing", it isn't "focusing on the void while you meditate", it isn't "focus on not focusing". It is letting go of all those things and everything else to simply *be* empty rather than /think/ empty. Difference between thinking and doing: in your mind think about lifting your arm, and then let go of that thought and actually lift your arm instead of just thinking about lifting your arm.

It's like having a glass full of oil, and trying to empty the glass by pouring in water (because oil will rise above water and eventually flow over the edges if you add enough water); you now have a clearer and more fluid substance in the glass, but the glass is not empty. To empty the glass, you tip it over and remove as much substance as possible from within it and leave it tipped over for the water droplets on the inside of the glass to eventually leave as well.

~kakkarot
So we are actually in agreeance our terms are merely different. :elephant:
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Xiphere on July 28, 2005, 11:32:28 AM
Nice article, Ive used this in martial arts. I like to use Focal Meditation in school especially study hall when i have nothing to do i just focus on something for awhile, etc. Afterwards im usually a little bitmore awake in school, but that would make sense since meditation is kinda refreshing your mind. :cool:


-X-
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: ChezNips on July 29, 2005, 09:29:24 AM
I'd like to add that when you are meditating and the fears crop up or you feel emotions like anger, then you are not in a meditative deep state.  When you are in that state, its a release of the thoughts that keep you pegging in the time/space factor and not relaxed.  You need to either focus on something to keep the mind passively focused or to dismiss stray thoughts insted of engaging in them.  The mind will stay in beta or snap back into beta state if a thought is engages such as a fear or thoughts of anger.  WHile meditating the idea is to release the hold of consciousness meaning that we start to notice less and less of where we are sitting, the aches and pains of our bodies, stray sounds, or even the passage of time.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Aos711 on July 31, 2005, 09:13:22 PM
how do u achieve void meditation?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: SleepWalker on August 02, 2005, 02:37:44 AM
I'd like to add that when you are meditating and the fears crop up or you feel emotions like anger, then you are not in a meditative deep state.  When you are in that state, its a release of the thoughts that keep you pegging in the time/space factor and not relaxed.  You need to either focus on something to keep the mind passively focused or to dismiss stray thoughts insted of engaging in them.  The mind will stay in beta or snap back into beta state if a thought is engages such as a fear or thoughts of anger.  WHile meditating the idea is to release the hold of consciousness meaning that we start to notice less and less of where we are sitting, the aches and pains of our bodies, stray sounds, or even the passage of time.

If you experience something in your meditation you have not before, fear is the expected occurance.
For example the first tim you astral, the fear can be quite extroardinary.

Quote from:  Aos711
how do u achieve void meditation?
It is not something that can be achieved in the truest sense, It's more of a concept.
Focal meditation is your best bet.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Gond on August 04, 2005, 04:50:11 AM
I already use glasses, and maybe two meters can prevent bad things to te eyes, but, if we are supposed to look to a candle with the mind and not exactly with the eyes, then it is supposed not to look really to the cande, but to anywhere close to the candle and focus on the candle, and see it, but not in the mindle of the vision camp, maybe on the left upper corner, is this cprrect, and we aren't looking to the candle, but we are still focused on it, is this correct?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: SleepWalker on August 07, 2005, 11:18:08 AM
To be aware of the candle and to draw focus is the reason for it.
You can invision the candle in your mind as long as you are in awareness of the candle.
Ofcourse if you do not look at the candle you cannot see any results.
Perhaps meditate on the invisioned flame and look at it only when you are manipulating it.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Sai Astar on September 24, 2005, 08:44:57 PM
Question!

What am I to expect from focal meditation? Pardon my noviceness in psionics but what results should I expect and when do I know that I have mastered it? The easiest thing to say would be that I should try it and see for myself, but I just want to know if there is a standard for everyone.

I have worked with psionics without knowing it, just by focusing on objects with my mind for extended periods of time, such as candles, weapons, grass, and other inanimate objects. Is there anything standard or widely excepted about what should happen or what I should feel?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on September 25, 2005, 01:25:43 AM
What am I to expect from focal meditation? Pardon my noviceness in psionics but what results should I expect and when do I know that I have mastered it? The easiest thing to say would be that I should try it and see for myself, but I just want to know if there is a standard for everyone.
...
 Is there anything standard or widely excepted about what should happen or what I should feel?

There are variances in the experience for different people, but the general trends are described under the section "Deep meditation".
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Fou Lu on November 22, 2005, 11:02:22 PM
Can we focus on the object in our mind?  For example, can I close my eyes and picture an object, and focus on that?  Would that be of any more or less benefit?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on November 22, 2005, 11:52:48 PM
Can we focus on the object in our mind?  For example, can I close my eyes and picture an object, and focus on that?  Would that be of any more or less benefit?

Yes, this works too.  It's the focus which is important for focal meditation, not the target.  External objects to focus on, especially alluring ones, can be much easier to work with when beginning, and provide a more potent method of regaining ones focus.  But focusing internally is more convenient in the long run, because you will always have your mind with you, even when you don't have a candle.

In addition to the candle being an object which naturally attracts attention, it provides an ideal transition to kinesis practice, and for this reason makes a particularly useful starting point.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Nirioso on December 03, 2005, 01:15:13 PM
I have a question. It may depend on the person, but...

Would listening to some music help?

Or do you think that'd be too much of a distraction? :p

and please don't flame me for bringint the topic back to life. ): I hadn't looked at the last date..
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Falcon on December 04, 2005, 10:12:31 AM
The point of Focal meditation is to concentrate on a single point, so music will distract you.

Normal meditation is fine to have a bit of music on in the background!
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Nirioso on December 06, 2005, 04:20:21 PM
Oh.... that's sort of impossible for me to do. Its pretty noisy at my house.... maybe before bed when everyone else is sleeping...  :|
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: sarpesius on December 16, 2005, 04:31:09 AM
Anything can be used to focus on.

If there is music focus on one aspect of the music.

You can focus on looking at a single spec of lint on the floor.

Having to fight off the music may increase your concentration.

You can practice mindfulness just walking down the street or doing anything. 

You can practice focusing on a single thought.

Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: amidos on January 24, 2006, 03:24:30 PM
~TAO~
"Into a soul absolutely free
From thoughts and emotion,
Even the tiger finds no room
To insert its fierce claws.
....
....

Victory is for the one,
Even before the combat,
Who has no thought of himself,
Abiding in the Thoughtless state of True Origin."

The Taoist poet of a by-gone time stresses more and more on the achivement of the state of thoughtless purity. Clarity of sight and action, that is not rendered impure nor distracted by any way by the waves of thought, in the tranquil lake of Mind, seems to be the loftiest of spiritual ideals. Something akin to the "Nirvikalpam" state of Vedanta, or the beginning of Yoga Sutras of Seer Patanjali. "Yogas-Chitta_vritti_Nirodha"  ~  meaning,
"Yoga" is the method of obliterating all blemishes or ripples of thought from the mind lake, or Chitta.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: AngryLeprachaun on February 23, 2006, 08:24:06 PM
I heard or read in this book awhile ago that evil spirits from the underworld or hell, could pass and stay in your body when doing deep meditation.  Is this true?

-AngryLep-
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: zaigon on February 24, 2006, 08:02:53 PM
AngryLeprachaun, I do not claim to be a meditation expect, heck, all i know is pretty much what i have read from this site, but I do not believe that would be true, or else someone would have mentioned it here or in another topic. If an evil spirit was to inhabit ones body while they are meditating then many of the people here would probably tell you NOT to meditate while it is quite the opposite. But i guess there is a possibility that i may be wrong. I have seen things on TV and such where, while people were meditating, supposedly spirits of the dead came and the meditating person would begin drawing or writing, supposedly with handwritting, writting style, or art style of the spirit that was pocessing their body or whatever. Not entirly sure that i believe it, but i'm not entirly sure what to believe these days.

Overall. I'd say no. If someone who has more experience can say otherwise then i'd listen to them.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: AngryLeprachaun on February 26, 2006, 08:47:48 AM
Well, it does seem logical in a way though.  When you are meditating, you open you mind and let almost "anything past it".  Therefore, if you were meditating and an evil spirit happened to come and pass through your mind and somehow locked itself in your body, then you are so called pocessed.  Well, I would like to hear an experts point of view also.

-AngryLep-
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on February 26, 2006, 01:57:49 PM
Well, it does seem logical in a way though.  When you are meditating, you open you mind and let almost "anything past it".  Therefore, if you were meditating and an evil spirit happened to come and pass through your mind and somehow locked itself in your body, then you are so called pocessed.  Well, I would like to hear an experts point of view also.

You let distractions pass by without accepting them, but in actuality, you are focusing and strengthening yourself while doing this.  In fact, if you note question 4.3 of the Psi FAQ (http://forums.vsociety.net/topic/4857.0), you'll see that meditation can actually improve your defense more rigorously and deeply than shielding.

Rather than worrying about being governed by evil spirits though, it is far more insightful to worry about not being in control of yourself much in the first place.  People who do not meditate have their lives and choices more frequently governed by distractions, while those who meditate properly end up in more consistent control of their own lives and actions.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: AngryLeprachaun on March 03, 2006, 04:17:41 PM
That is what I wanted to hear.  Thank you, Kobok.

-AngryLep-
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Psionic on May 21, 2006, 04:35:11 PM
I have two simple questions I would like to ask regarding Focal Mediation.

1) Does the focal mediation becomes difficult or easier with age? People often starting out later in their lives, is there any difference in access Psi energy when much older?

2) Sometimes people may have physical limitation that interferes the focal mediation and what can they do about this?
  I refer to tinnitus (the audio malfunction ringing the ears) and having the body being stiff for long periods of time that could cause discomfort.

Thanks,
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on May 21, 2006, 09:15:09 PM
1) Does the focal mediation becomes difficult or easier with age? People often starting out later in their lives, is there any difference in access Psi energy when much older?

Age has no fundamental effect.  But there is a tendency for young people to not be used to sitting still for long, moreso in some cultures than in others.  This is made irrelevant by a little dedication and practice, after which one just becomes used to it.

2) Sometimes people may have physical limitation that interferes the focal mediation and what can they do about this?
  I refer to tinnitus (the audio malfunction ringing the ears) and having the body being stiff for long periods of time that could cause discomfort.

Fundamentally, tinnitus should have no more effect than you permit it to have, as this would be the same as any other background sensation that you learn to ignore as you are focusing on the target.  To make this easier for beginners, there are a few steps you could take which should reduce the effect of tinnitus while meditating, such as the presence of a metronome or of background white noise (http://forums.vsociety.net/topic/8133.0).

As for the body being stiff, find ways to make it comfortable.  You could even do focal meditation in a heated spa.  And if necessary it is acceptable to shift positions slightly every 10-15 minutes or so.  The distraction from this will be minimal and with practice you should be able to quickly return to your previous depth.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: cloudrise on April 11, 2007, 02:23:45 PM
quick question. i just started on this and after a while the wall and stuff sitting behind the candle started to turn black and i couldnt see it. all i could see was the candle. but this effect only lasted for a few seconds before the background came back into focus. is this normal for a first timer??
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Tsumaru on April 11, 2007, 07:02:04 PM
This is perfectly normal for everybody and shows that you're doing the meditation properly (ie, you're not moving your eyes around or adjusting focus etc) In fact, as you continue to progress you'll probably notice a few trippy things like that happening. Just remember to keep gazing at the candle and don't get distracted as these occur due to the focus and will stop when you break that focus.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Windsmover001 on April 11, 2007, 09:22:18 PM
At the beggenning of the article, I think kobok hit the nail in the the wall, or how should I say it the neuron to spark...  Meditation is the way.  I also caution to the wind fro personal experience that that can open good and bad doors. You simply need to learn how to do it.  It's like anything in life, you either have a "knack" to learn it or you won't.  Some can be apprentices or masters.  You just have to put your mind to it, and you can do it.

In earlier posts it was asked if music can help this.  I think that depends on an individual basis.  Music can also be a learning experience.  I'd like to quote a few words from a song, if I may, and please correct me if I'm not allowed to do that.

...."the man who will cover for Don Juan's old soothsayer.  An appeassed has been reached with the teacher of the rich..."---Performed by  PET SHOP BOYS song title: "Don Juan" from the album "Alternative"
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kingdom on April 24, 2007, 12:33:05 PM
what is meditation ive read lots of articles and i concluded that its just clearing your mind for a peirod of time but how does that help psiioncs
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Felidae on April 24, 2007, 09:26:07 PM
Meditation is a fairly broad term for a series of disciplines wich have the end result if noit the goal-some forms of meditation especially are almost anti-goal, and focusing on the goal rather than the practice in the rest is an issue- of developing the awareness. Since psionics is based upon leaning to use ones base awareness and then extend it outwards to explore the realm of consiousness and intersection with physical, meditation is of primary importance.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Dimentio on May 13, 2007, 03:54:06 PM
 Tinnitus (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tinnitus) was mentioned earlier.

Aside from white noise or a metronome, you could also try binaural beats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Binaural_beats). They have been shown by several studies to influence brainwaves, which is really good for beginners. Not to mention it could help block off background noise.

Gnaural (http://gnaural.sourceforge.net/) is a free program that generates these beats. It runs under Windows and Linux, and can let you customize the beats however you wish. For those who don't want to download , go through the hassle of compiling it themselves, or those who use Macintosh OS X, there is also a java version (http://pantheon.yale.edu/%7Ebbl2/GnauralJavaApplet_signed.html). It's a bit like the Ganzfeld Meditation Applet (http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php?topic=8133.0). (But it doesn't have the cool swirls  :()

I have wondered about over-dependence though, so I suggest practicing without it as well.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Frostlock on October 17, 2007, 08:18:34 AM
Sorry for ignoring the out of date thing..lets say i can now deep meditate easly and i do it very well..what would be the next step in learning psi?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Secret Rose on November 22, 2007, 06:44:37 PM
Tinnitus was mentioned earlier, I have tinnitus and vertigo (dizziness) and I don't seem to be bothered with that as long as I don't concentrate on it.  I don't know why but the past couple of days I've kind of been zoning out really quickly as if in meditation, for no reason.  Like I'll be putting something into the refrigerator and then I won't really be aware of my surroundings and time seems to pass by very slowly.  Or if I'm looking at something my eyes will automatically defocus from everything for awhile.  <---What does this mean?   

Also, when I get dizzy spells sometimes I'm almost automatically placed into a meditative state because I can't really focus at all on the things going around me, and I can't do anything but just sit and basically do nothing.  I can't process thought either.  But I'm positive this isn't exactly a meditative state. 

Sorry for the length of my post, but I have one more question, Would meditation possibly calm down an asthma attack?  Or would it be too hard to reach that state of mind in that condition?  I have recurring asthma and sometimes my medication does not always work. 

Thank you for your help!

~Secret Rose
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: BohmaN on April 13, 2008, 01:55:47 PM
I've heard from some people that letting your eyes focus on a distinct point could cause retinal damage if done too much. Is that true?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Bad Warrior on April 13, 2008, 05:54:57 PM
From simple biological view, it's not.
Focusing your view on a distant point is made by lens in your eye changing it's shape.
Unless you spend 5 years of nonstop focusing on distant shapes, nothing will happen.
Of course if after focusing you look at things close to you, to make your lens go to other shape.
You should look about the same amount of time at distant and close points through your life, and if you don't have any eye worsening genes and you eat well, your eyes should be good :)

[with age lenses tend to congeal (people say it's because you dont eat butter ) and you may see worse, at this point of view
"letting your eyes focus on a distinct point could cause retinal damage if done too much" but only if you do it really much]

Do you understand, or should I post here how lenses in eyes shape to let you focus on distant and close shapes?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: wneo1982 on September 24, 2008, 12:33:02 AM
now i know why i was awake for 4 contiues days :)
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: supadude on October 15, 2008, 12:43:15 PM
Ive always had a problem with meditation, i never seem to be able to go into that meditative state of peace, i know your not waiting for any particular outcome of it, it just seems that i can go in, but never any deeper =/
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Big Boss on October 15, 2008, 02:27:57 PM
There seems to be this common misconception about meditation round these parts. The esoteric "ZOMG I can meditate for 12 hours on end and no one can interrupt me while I do the splits and MEDITATE and find my place in the universe blah blah blah" is a meditation saved for Monks and Yogis who do nothing BUT meditate for 12 hours a day. You will not achieve perfect Zen meditation in 15 minutes, or even 15 months. Look at 15+ years to get the meditation everyone thinks we are talking about on Veritas.

Focal meditation is just that. It is sitting down for a bit and clearing your mind of everything but one singular thought process. In this article, the example is clearing your mind of everything except the flame you are staring at. When you are attempting kinesis, your single thought is on kinesis. When you are building a construct, you think of nothing but the construct. You are developing focus on one thing. It will not be perfect in one day. You may even struggle for a few moments at a time after practicing for a few months, but if you are focusing better after fifteen minutes of following kobok's advice, you have succeeded in at least a small way and are on the fast track to improvement.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: supadude on October 16, 2008, 11:14:37 AM
lol, i see your point, but couldnt hemi-sync cd's help with that?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Big Boss on October 17, 2008, 03:29:22 AM
Give them a try. Some people say they work, others say they are a distraction. My only suggestion would be a word of caution against relying on a crutch to meditate. It'd be like a band that got really good while they were high, and then when their big show came up, they couldn't find any drugs so the show sucked. Sure, maybe the drugs inspired their creativity, but without it, they lost everything.

That's probably not the best metaphor, but I think you get the idea.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: supadude on October 23, 2008, 08:16:53 AM
Give them a try. Some people say they work, others say they are a distraction. My only suggestion would be a word of caution against relying on a crutch to meditate. It'd be like a band that got really good while they were high, and then when their big show came up, they couldn't find any drugs so the show sucked. Sure, maybe the drugs inspired their creativity, but without it, they lost everything.

That's probably not the best metaphor, but I think you get the idea.
yes, but you could look at the crutch as a help for a man too weak to walk, so he uses the crutches to support him until he is able to stand on his own.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: disciple of the ages on January 01, 2009, 05:31:19 PM
I never knew this type of meditation existed, but I did this all the time as a child. I had very bad ADD (still do :p) but I would always focus on a specific light in my room and everything else would grow exceedingly dark, until nothing else existed in my visual area. In this time, there were many concepts that came to me. I should try doing this again with the candle. Thanks for the original post kobok!
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Dazza on January 01, 2009, 06:51:23 PM
Give them a try. Some people say they work, others say they are a distraction. My only suggestion would be a word of caution against relying on a crutch to meditate. It'd be like a band that got really good while they were high, and then when their big show came up, they couldn't find any drugs so the show sucked. Sure, maybe the drugs inspired their creativity, but without it, they lost everything.

That's probably not the best metaphor, but I think you get the idea.
yes, but you could look at the crutch as a help for a man too weak to walk, so he uses the crutches to support him until he is able to stand on his own.

About hemisync, the gateway experience in particular, I used to practice these a couple of years ago and if you are doing them properly they are seen as training wheels which are to be dropped when you don't need them anymore. In fact when I tried the technique by itself without audio I was surprised to find it worked even better than usual! I guess it was because I had become used to it in some degree and I could also go at my own pace.

But back to topic, I would reccomend it for lucid dreaming and getting into the body asleep/mind awake stage but not focal meditation. Patience and consistency will help you get into deep meditation.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Epsilon Rose on March 01, 2010, 10:26:21 PM
Sorry for resurrecting this topic but it seems to be the best place for questions about focal meditation.
I'm just starting and I'm using an ace of spades as a focus because candles don't work for me for various reasons and I've come up with three questions that I was hoping to get some help sorting through:
1. what's the difference between just staring at some thing and not thinking about other things and focusing on something?
2. I get to a point where every thing but the card disappears into a black field with a strobing pattern, but it quickly goes back to what it was directly before(every thing around the card looks like it was rendered by a glitching graphics card) or normal, and blinking extra or breathing deeper make it disappear faster (through out this the card is at least as clear as normal, sometimes the wight parts become slightly luminescent). So this actually results in two questions: a) is this supposed to happen and b) if so why does it keep going away?
3. my eyes tend to get slightly dry and very teary which causes me to blink extra and harder which disrupts my focus, any tips on preventing this?

thank you
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on March 14, 2010, 08:45:46 PM
1. what's the difference between just staring at some thing and not thinking about other things and focusing on something?

Not thinking simply describes what's not happening.  Focusing is actually DOING something, because one's attention is actually asserted toward the thing.  This is in some sense an active process.

2. I get to a point where every thing but the card disappears into a black field with a strobing pattern, but it quickly goes back to what it was directly before(every thing around the card looks like it was rendered by a glitching graphics card) or normal, and blinking extra or breathing deeper make it disappear faster (through out this the card is at least as clear as normal, sometimes the wight parts become slightly luminescent). So this actually results in two questions: a) is this supposed to happen and b) if so why does it keep going away?

This is quite normal, so you shouldn't be concerned.  You also shouldn't worry about it coming or going too much, because the focal meditation is ultimately not about these transitory visual effects.  They just often happen as a side-effect of the normal process.

3. my eyes tend to get slightly dry and very teary which causes me to blink extra and harder which disrupts my focus, any tips on preventing this?

Yes, relax your eye muscles, and also allow your eyes to blink normally.  You do not focus with your eyes, you focus with your mind.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: harder on August 02, 2010, 11:37:23 AM
Hello,
         Wow this is really very good information. i really didn't have enough information about this Focal Meditation. but after knowing this i will also try this. thanks for this wonderful information.

thanks!!

________________
guided meditation  (http://www.meditation-power.com)
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: AriesofGod on September 17, 2010, 09:10:00 PM
Wow!  I had been looking so forward to this since about Wednesday.  I legitimately have not had 'all that' much time for it and most definitely have not been feeling well, considering I just recently came down with one of my seasonal sinus infections :^'(  It surely has only gotten worse since then, and so has my attitude.  But as I am a strong believer in consulting the tarot they have never led me wrong and encouraged me to keep fighting.

I didn't have a candle, but I after relieving some stress ^^ and a hot shower, there was no doubt in my mind that NOW was the time.  I sat, where I know will be the clearest area of my house and bedroom, kept on the dimmest light I have ( a not too dim lamp, or not dim enough rather ) and sat on the floor, NOT intending to necessarily do any focal meditation.  After having read a slight bit about kundalini and watching the youtube video I saw in the 'kundalini' post, I decided it would be best to just get comfortable ( in a position I was hardly comfortable in on a hardwood floor ) , clear my mind and gradually work myself into comfortability and different rhythms of breathing as it felt right.  Side Note:  I am NOT a major or regular practitioner of, well, anything really, though in the past five years I have done a considerable amount of dabbling in 'AP,' a bit of shamanism ( I know, lol, it's not really shamanism if it's just ' a bit' ), Tarot ( I only recently found great use for it ), a considerable bit of magick reading, color breathing, quite a good amount of meditating on and off ( it's become a great assistant in falling sleep, clearing my mind very quickly ), and, admittedly I have taken a couple of formal Tai Chi courses.  Some of my teachers and 'advisors' ( not of the Astral sort ) have expressed that I have an aptitude at particularly, controlling my energy ( for my noviceness that is ), and healing ( been doing deep massages since I was 6 ), and in my personal opinion my most cultivated skill, meditating ( focus of the mind, self-control ). 

As is typical ( except for position/posture ), my mind went blank.  Thoughts, passed easily, quickly, yet constructively ( as much as it can be in meditation, not like I was focusing on particular concepts ).  I breathed deeply, and my conciousness, very gradually, faded.  A lot of shifting was necessary, but I didn't break my meditation ( eyes still closed ) or let the uncomfortable thoughts get to me, I simply shifted to whatever made me feel more comfortable and continued breathing in a rhythm accordingly.  Images of the Kundalini CGI video passed through my mind as I shifted and thoughts of the snake seemed fitting for the concentrated pain in my spine and legs, so I continued to shift and breathe.  I have only had cursory glances at the hand postures for the yoga chakra meditations, but they proved to be helpful.

I know, this post is going to be long, but I'll say once now, and again at the end, that I go into so much detail because these are things that I would have liked to have known prior to the meditation as someone who has only dabbled/read here or there and would quickly lose confidence because of the uncomfortability.

I continue, my legs were shaking in this unfamiliar posture, so for a time, I had to lightly, but in a controlled manner, grip them, and continue shifting.  This proved not to be detrimental, or a distraction, and ended up being very helpful.  As I shifted it was apparent that I was lining up my chakras and, as the meditation deepened, the energy ( and slight pain ) continued to advance up my spine.  The meditation again deepened and this is where my little knowledge of hand postures came into play.  After enough shifting, my legs were shaking much less and I was considerably more comfortable... enough to settle my hands on my legs, near the knees, thumb and forefinger touching.  Little adjustments in every little thing are key.  You will not lose focus, and I encourage you to stick with it.  I allowed even the nicotine fits to pass through as I continued to breathe good wholesome aire.  As the meditation continues to deepen, the pain of my body begins to become less important.  I remember the power I can embrace within me, and the pain in my spine near my solar plexus becomes firm resolve.  Yes, I shift yet again, and many times more ( up to a certain point, which still I allowed a little shifting ).  With this focus on my solar plexus and a new sense of balance now maintained ( it did take time, take your time, it absolutely did not come easy.  I just took my time and continued to breathe. ) I realized that my hands seem to play a role in my balance, and the significance of these mysterious hand gestures became more clear.  I shifted, and moved my hands beneath my solar plexus, left palm up, fingers curling my my right hand; my right hand, a fist.  I moved on, eventually, to my heart, with my hands in front of it, so as to hold my energy moving up.  My right hand closest to my chest, only my thumbs of my left and right hands crossed ( like a butterfly ).  Felt like a bird carrying my energy above my heart and making it lighter.  Now, all pain left my legs ( and numbness left my awareness ) as my energy moved up to my collar bone and opened my throat.  Remembering truth, remembering -my- inner music, something I needed to focus on for me personally ( as well as being firm in my solar plexus ).  Another Note:  moving the hands, to the heart and every point forward was necessary to continue the flow of energy. Also IMPORTANT:  Once at this point, your hands are to significant to lose their posture, any shifting must be subtle slides of the legs, my right leg shifted forward slightly, involuntarily, from that point forward what pain and uncomfortability meant little, and I was forced to continue pushing, or else give up, which would've taken a while to do with any benefits, so it's best just to push, it does get better.  I could feel my crown calling me, begging for my triumph, but my will was near ready to falter, but I could not give up.  I shifted my hands in front of my throat and pointed up with both forefingers meeting.  This did the trick, maybe about ten minutes or so and spent in my third eye and my crown.  I know my crown is undeveloped, but was a grateful for what I got to experience.  My breathing, was full ( not to say that sometimes it wasn't a bit quicker, and shallower, it does shift according to your needs, even at the higher chakras ), my chakras as open I was willing to get them.  I closed by letting my hands go free, allowing my chakras to 'close' one by one, and some slight shifting.  Holding my legs again, whatever is comfortable.  Okay so I did some yoga, yay for me, that was fun.  I can do some focal meditation later I guess.  I opened my eyes, a little quicker then I expected, and then realized.. "NOPE, WRONG!"

My vision had a sort of pulse to it.  Things were blurred on the edges, but the phenomena was constantly shifting, and there was a bit of water in my eyes.  I kept breathing, this felt to good, just a little longer.  Then, on the wall, noticed a little flaw on it, right next to the floorboards, like a little wrinkle.  It came into focus, and blurred out, and my vision was just shifting like crazy, but my eyes stayed focused on the little, dented, deformed, flaw.  So many things it looked like, a geometric shape, a deep crack, it did not matter, this was my focal point.  I did a little ten minute focal meditation on a golden button on my bag I take to work on the bus the other day.  It was very relaxing, but when you are in a group of people that are very much a different culture than you, and there's maybe but you and another of your 'stereotype,' it can appear very harsh, cold, and offensive.  Now, let me tell you, the easy part starts there and then, staring at the wall.  You're eyes can close, blink, whatever, you can shift, just don't close your eyes for long and keep focusing on this little point in your reality, even if you can't see it or can hardly make it out.  Don't get distracted by the texture of the wall as it comes into focus, or even the well defined architecture of the floorboard as it begins to blur, and define, and take on a new meaning.  All you care about it buried deep within that little point.  I also saw colors, started to feel different parts of my brain, and then heard a low, but defined tone; and began to feel it, too.  I feel the progression through the deeper stages are explained very well by the author of this article, but, once you start to get to the higher frequencies things start to get tricky.  It almost feels as it has all gone away, but something keeps developing, and pushing you forward.  You have felt all of the way out to high, quick frequencies, with very focused changes in your vision and a learned self-control.  It really does seem like you can go on like this forever and continue to allow your perception to shift this way, keeping in mind you are gathering information about what exactly your 'soul' is.  But the next exciting part is coming back down.

You can learn the most about yourself, now that you've experienced this high frequency of energy, and gathered so much of it as you gather it in to your self before putting it down through the ground.  It is when you breathe in and think of your self, that you truly begin to feel yourself and different parts of yourself.. and once you put the energy back out around you, you can even begin to learn even more.  The entire experience as a whole was nothing short of convincing, evolving, and phenomenal.  Thank you, Lord, for guiding me to this way of doing things, and thank you also, kobok, Kettle, and vsociety as a whole for all of the encouragement to start basic and refine your skills gradually.  I look forward to becoming more away of my self and and gaining, permanently, some of the abilities I seemed to experience during this meditation.  I'm not exactly kineting at this point, and I possibly never will work with the Psi abilities like I intend to work with magick, but I hopefully say that I'm starting on the right foot for both.

Thanks again,  Yours Truly,

Justin.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Shiki on August 12, 2011, 12:46:38 PM
Hello,

I tried to start meditating lots of times, but with some deplorable results. It seems I just can't get focused, the more I try, the more my mind wanders, or I start thinking about a music (And just CAN'T get it out of my mind, it's annoying  :headwall:), so I gave up for a time. More recently, one friend pointed out that I may have ADHD-I (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ADHD_predominantly_inattentive), but while I search for professional help about this I wanted to keep trying. Any hints about what should I do?

Also, one day I tried using earplugs, since there are all kind of distracting noises here. After a time staring the candle, a loud tinnitus started to distract me from it. It got even louder when I focused on it, and resembled me of binaural beats or something like that. Is that normal?

Sorry for resurrecting the topic.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: `Nazukarr on August 13, 2011, 09:13:42 PM
At the end of the day, the solution is to simply suck it up and focus. That sounds harsh but you will find that eventually it will be easier to tune out distractions. Even during your meditation when you're completely irate from not being able to focus, as long as you're staring at the candle for 45 + minutes, you're doing your job. What I found during my first couple of practices is that even though my mind seemed to be jabbering away the whole time, by the end of my 50 minute block, I was far more focused than at the beginning of my practice. That's an accomplishment. My thoughts were very streamlined when I attempted to watch TV or read after. Eventually, I started to actually experience a significant amount of practical success. So, whenever you find yourself frustrated with the distractions, just power through and keep staring at the candle. Hopefully you'll experience even a small amount of success after doing so and you'll stop being frustrated.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Shiki on August 15, 2011, 04:13:25 PM
Thanks for the help :).
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Midas on September 14, 2011, 03:13:36 PM
Can I do the candle meditation with a tealight? And is there an alternative to candles and fire?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Mindlessinvalid on September 14, 2011, 04:01:00 PM
well duh, focal meditation itself is just focusing all of your attention on an object. it's inherently easy to do that with fire, but you could use a pencil or a coin instead.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Hellblazer on September 14, 2011, 04:17:52 PM
A button sized black dot centered on a white sheet of paper, a spot on the wall, a door knob, a flower, etc. Really the whole point of focal meditation is to fix one's attention onto something. To learn how to focus the mind and will.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Violet on September 15, 2011, 08:56:15 AM
Can I do the candle meditation with a tealight? And is there an alternative to candles and fire?
As BubbaFett and Mindlessinvalid already pointed out, yes, you can use another object of focus. Notice that kobok already says so in the original article: "If you are unable to do this [= practice with a candle], substitute the flame in the following description for the focal object of your choice." Read, people. :wink: Nevertheless, I would advise using a candle flame if at all possible. The very simple reason for this is that trying to focus for prolonged periods of time on a static object tends to be more difficult. I, at least, daydreamed a lot as a beginner while trying to focus on dots on walls, doorhandles and all sorts of odd objects I used to focus on.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Imperio on September 22, 2011, 05:32:09 AM
What PSI means ?
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Willi on September 22, 2011, 02:26:33 PM
What PSI means ?

As far as I can remember, psi is short for parapsychology.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Mindlessinvalid on September 22, 2011, 06:49:42 PM
What PSI means ?

Psi is the greek letter that is used to designate a variable that cannot be empirically ascertained. thus its used in parapsychology research alot.

Not to be confused with psy (which is a corruption of the word psyche, meaning soul)
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Violet on November 19, 2011, 07:58:52 AM
Nice..the basic idea is correct..but in actuality you want get anywhere with this unless you know what you are doing. Meditation is not something you play with and without proper guidance you wouldn't even know where you'll end up.
Meditation is perfectly safe and in the case of focal meditation perfectly straightforward.

Do you even know why we meditate looking at a candle? If you really want to attain any so called abilities you must first attain a certain mental state. In buddhisam we call it "dyana". There are four such states. Each with a higher energy than the other.  Well you can't call it energy really, cos you don't really know what it is. All i can say is that you feel something rising up your spine and your upper body starts to vibrate methodically. And also it becomes rigid and straight, automatically.You just sit there and shake while you feel like you find yourself on a clear early morning (sort of the feeling you get when you go outside at around 4 or 5 AM). Its a wonderful sensation but you want get any special powers i assure you :) Try meditating on your breathing, at the point between your nose and mouth. Just look at it with your mind. Don't follow it, just know its there. If you do it correctly, you'll know what i'm talking about. And if you want to go deeper, come to Sri Lanka, and you'll get something much greater than just psi powers..
I'm trying to think of the best way to reply to this. Did you even read the article? For example, "do you even know why we meditate looking at a candle?" is a foolish question, as kobok gives an answer to that very question in his article. No esoteric stuff mentioned, just the fact that it's much easier to concentrate on. Also, if you want to do advertising for another type of metaphysical practice, please do so at a separate thread.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Violet on November 20, 2011, 05:24:04 AM
You don't look at a candle and meditate because its easy to concentrate on.
You do. Though perhaps even more important is that the candle flame is one of the best kinesis targets for a beginner.

It appears to me you haven't read the article. Let me show you: "The most basic focal meditation is simply to select an object and stare at that object, focusing all of your thoughts and awareness on that object.  Any object will do for this; it can be as simple as a spot on the wall or a dot drawn on paper.  The best objects to select are the ones which help to draw your attention.  One example of an object which does this for many people would be a crystal.  However, the best object for focal meditation in psi seems to be the candle flame."

If you tried it, you would have noticed how your eyes hurt after some time.
If your eyes hurt, you're sitting too close to the candle. Also, you should focus with your mind, not your eyes. Kobok has already said this here (http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php/topic,4867.msg168523.html#msg168523) and here (http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php/topic,4867.msg68435.html#msg68435).

The purpose of looking at the flame is to blah blah blah
No, it's not. Kobok posted this article and described a specific psi meditation technique that involves focusing on a candle flame. It is just silly to walk in here and pretend that the purpose of this exercise is different from what kobok - the person who thought of the exercise in the first place - wrote about it. If you use a different technique to achieve whatever you want to achieve, that's fine. But please don't pretend, not even to yourself, that people practice the same thing you do just because you want them to.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Mammon on November 20, 2011, 11:16:30 PM
ill have to disagree with you on one point... don't let yourself fool you.... in my opinion, your reality is what you believe....if you believe something through to your bones...to you ABSOLUTE core then nothing is impossible... it just takes time to train yourself out of what society has already trained you to believe and whats taught when your a child and reinforced through years of teachings and thoughts that such things are not possible... but if you train yourself to believe and you overcome your childhood teachings then nothing if outside of your grasp... but thats just my opnion...
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Violet on November 21, 2011, 12:18:40 AM
Ok then, let me ask you this. Did you achieve any deep meditation states through this?
Yes. I achieved the deep meditation state described in this article. I did not achieve deep meditation as described by you. I repeat, that was not the purpose of this exercise.

And also you should know that kobok wasn't the one who thought up this exercise. This is written in buddhist scriptures long long time ago. He got the general idea, i'm just blah blah blah again
Let me give you a hypothetical example. Suppose I were the first person to think of basketball and was playing it with a couple of friends. Now, netball has a different set of rules, primary among them that you're not allowed to move when holding the ball and you're only allowed to be on certain areas of the court depending on your playing position. Therefore, someone who plays netball and has not heard of basketball will probably see this and tell us "well, you're getting the general idea, but you should do it more like this; also, it's dangerous when you're all running on the court like that!". A reaction like that is understandable. However, when the basketball players clarify that they're, in fact, not playing netball and using a different set of rules, the netball player should shut up about his game. When someone's playing a different game, it's stupid to complain that they're not following the same rules. And when compared to your buddhistic meditation, dynamic psi is a very different game.

I did not say that kobok was the first person ever to think of meditation with a focal point. That's obviously untrue. What I did say was that "focal meditation" is a specific psi technique kobok thought of. What this means is that, sure, there are plenty of meditation techniques, and no doubt many of them are very similar; Kobok's article, however, was made with the practice of psi in mind. This is why I'm 'hanging on to every word of this kobok person' in this thread, it's relevant! These buddhist techniques are not. You can't just walk in on someone who practices a different paradigm, and tell them they've 'got the general idea' of your paradigm.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Violet on November 21, 2011, 10:10:26 AM
There are no different games..Its the same game, same arena..
When there are different rules and different goals, how can you keep saying it's the same game?

Obviously there are certain rules that apply to all games. I never said there weren't. You, however, seem to think that all games must necessarily use all the same rules; that whenever a game doesn't use your set of rules, people are doing it 'wrong'. If this is what you think, I invite you to explain why there are so many different metaphysical paradigms.

Also, you seem to be under the impression that I do not want to try out your paradigm. This has nothing to do with what's being discussed in this thread. As a matter of fact, I have some years of experience with more mystical forms of meditation, and the meditation you described is no exception. I would not presume to be a master of any such technique, but neither am I a stranger to it. However, this thread isn't about any of that. This thread is about focal meditation, a psi technique. Therefore, we won't discuss my willing- or unwillingness to participate in other paradigms in this thread.

Last but not least, your post has some logical issues. At first you say that there are no different games, yet later on in your post you say 'your reality is what you believe'. The underlying problem here is that the latter implies that everything is subjective (even though that statement is in itself an assertion of objectivity, but we'll ignore that for a moment), even though you just said that there are no different games - which implies objectivity.

(You can easily contact kobok via PM, by the way.)
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: kobok on November 21, 2011, 12:58:44 PM
If you don't believe me, ask kobok yourself where he got this exercise from.

I made it up, based almost entirely on my own self-discoveries from staring at candle flames.  Just, I was not the first person to come up with a meditation exercise involving a candle flame, and I will not be the last person to do so.  It is such a potent approach that it is regularly rediscovered.

Meditation was originated in india

I highly doubt that.  I suspect meditation predates the presence of our species in India.  I think you'd have a hard time finding a culture from anywhere on the planet that doesn't have some form of meditation in it.  The form you have learned from Indian culture is just fine, but it is not the only functional approach.  The form I present here has been specifically tailored and tuned as a meditation approach ideal for learning psi, and it has worked well for this purpose for quite a lot of people so far.  Perhaps there is a superior approach, and if there is I'd like to see it, but I've been doing this for a while in the presence of the excellent information exchange which is the internet and I haven't seen a more ideal approach yet.

I've spent a lot of time practicing breathing meditations as well (which I also suspect predate human presence in India, as they are also very easy to rediscover).  They have good value, and you may find I've recommended people give them a try several times on the forums.  Focal meditation on the candle flame simply has specific advantages in terms of its excellent and smooth transition into kinesis practice (http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php/topic,4868.0.html), where the feedback provided by the flame provides a way to focus not just the mind, but the specifically identified soul.  This is of essential and critical value for well-controlled practice of psi, and it is why this article is structured in the way it is.

(EDIT - If the last few posts are confusing to follow, it is because the posts that this and the preceding several posts were replies to were deleted.  I am leaving the replies for the sake of completeness in responding to points raised.)
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Arkvoodle on March 01, 2012, 12:15:41 PM
Apologies for "grave digging", but I have a question. I am rather afraid of getting retina burn from focusing on the light for so long. Would the 2 meter distance reduce/eliminate this?  Are the alternatives as effective as the candle meditation? Just wondering, of course. The candle does seem to be the most reliable and effective method, but your opinion on the others would be welcome.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Violet on March 01, 2012, 04:24:11 PM
Would the 2 meter distance reduce/eliminate this?

I haven't had the problem you described, so I suspect this would work. Just don't forget to blink. (You shouldn't focus on the control of your eyelids either, as the purpose of this exercise is to concentrate on the candle flame. Rather, don't try to keep your eyes open because you think you should.) As for other methods of meditation, I have tried a few others, and focal meditation works best for me. Your mileage may vary.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Middelnil on August 14, 2014, 12:38:21 PM
A really good article, indeed. All this knowledge is much appreciated, especially to a newer member like me.

I just have one question that I can't seem to answer myself. I tried it first with a piece of metal and found that it worked quite well. Same thing with a candle's flame.
But since I decided to start developing my brow chakra, I thought that I'd get two birds with one stone since for me brow chakra requires meditating and focusing on the area of the chakra. That being said, it went really well at first. I could focus really well on the area of the chakra, feel the chakra, I reached gnosis really easily, etc. Although now after a while I find that my focus slips... Perhaps I should simply meditate first for a while to calm down my mind and then start focusing.

So, to get to the actual question: is what I described above a form of focal meditation? After all I am focusing all my thoughts and mind on the area of the brow chakra.


Oh, I'm sorry for posting in the old thread, but rather than starting a new thread on the question about this and filling the forums with my "still-a-newbie" comments, I thought I'd post on this thread.

Yours,
Middelnil
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Merlin on August 14, 2014, 04:35:55 PM
is what I described above a form of focal meditation? After all I am focusing all my thoughts and mind on the area of the brow chakra.
Yep, you can focus on whatever suits you best, whether that's an image, a concept, a point on your body, etc. Though some things like music may not work well.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: Middelnil on August 15, 2014, 02:19:53 PM
Alrighty, good to know. Thanks :)
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: SympOthetick on May 11, 2015, 02:48:53 AM
I am coming to this topic a tad late, and I just discovered this site a week ago. So a bit excited to go through past topics and posts even if a bit daunting with there being so many but persistence and patience and all. Though I wish to express how I have approached meditation and see how it relates.

I have pinned down my "sitting practice" down to... open-awareness observation and closed-awareness observation. Open-awareness observation is akin to the Zen mindfulness practice. and Closed-awareness observation being akin to concentration practice. I prefer the term awareness in there because I have come to realize that awareness is what awakens the experience to be had, so to speak; and here awareness being the essence of our soul. Thus I find my "sitting practice" as working the soul, or soul-work. Open-awareness would lead to letting any experience to be experienced, where as Closed-awareness is holding the experience in the process of observation.
Title: Re: Focal Meditation
Post by: P.O.S on January 15, 2017, 05:06:43 PM
 Is the meditation need to be steady and regular?