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Academic Areas => Study Groups => Qigong Study Group (2013) => Topic started by: Koujiryuu on June 20, 2013, 11:25:34 PM

Title: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Koujiryuu on June 20, 2013, 11:25:34 PM
Post your experiences with Baduanjin Qigong here.

This week is a little different. Since there are 8 different forms for this week's exercise, simply post the experiences you have with different forms that cause you to have a strong, noticeable experience. It is not required to post your experience with each of the 8 forms unless you want to.

For reference, the forms are:

1. Supporting the Sky with Both Hands
2. Draw a Bow to Each Side (modified Shaolin Archer)
3. Splitting Heaven and Earth
4. Monk Gazes at the Moon
5. Lowering the Head and Hips
6. Touch the Feet with Both Hands
7. Clenching the Fists
8. Shaking the Body
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: icefire on June 21, 2013, 06:29:25 AM
Initial exp. with baduanjin:

First I memorized the moves with the vid and did maybe two reps with each move. Then did the wuwei meditation for 30+ mins, before getting into this and doing the 6 moves per form. Didn't feel qi that much with most moves, except 7 and 8. I've done the Clenching the Fists before and it was easy to get into. Forgot 6 and had some moves in wrong order, but this will be good later I can feel it. :D
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Shinichi on June 22, 2013, 05:30:20 AM
Initial impressions after doing it last night: let the breath decide the pace of the movement.

I took slow, deep breaths in the buddhist fashion that we were taught early on, and I moved slowly according to the speed of the breath. As a result, some of the movements I did took twice or thrice as long to finish as what Kouji did in his video, and that is fine. I felt that it is important to not rush the movement, or to move first and breath second. Relax, breath, and let the breath lead the movement. At one point, it felt like I wasn't even moving my muscles, but that my body was simply following my breath and qi. That, was interesting.

The easiest to do movement was probably Touching The Feet, but I'm not quite sure I would call it my favorite. I'm not sure I have a favorite, because they are all very good. However, the one with the strongest effect was Splitting Heaven and Earth. When I pushed my hands apart, it felt like I was actually pushing something even though I didn't think about that, and the energy in my arms felt rather nice. I also felt strong energy movements all over my body, especially in my arms and head, throughout the entire set.

Overall, it was very nice, and doing this before doing my meditations seems to have had a very strong effect on clearing my mind. I think this is a keeper.  :P

Also, I think everyone should try doing the whole thing in Wuji. It is certainly a challenge, but apparently after some time in the gym it is not quite "hell" to me. Even with its difficulty, I think it adds a good element to the practice, and it might even make the practice a bit more effective--but, I haven't tried it without doing wuji, so I can't offer a full comparison yet.



~:Shin:~
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Koujiryuu on June 22, 2013, 01:35:03 PM
Shin: Doing it in Wuji the entire time will strengthen the muscles of the lower back, abdomen, upper legs, lower legs, ankles and knees = Jin (internal power)

My experience:

1. Supporting the Sky with Both Hands- Qi rises up the arms, and lowers back to the Dantian, but it makes my fingertips tingle, unlike Lifting the Sky.

2. Draw a Bow to Each Side (modified Shaolin Archer)- Qi on the forearms and tip of the index finger. I could see the aura around my hand pushing out easily when I focused on the fingertip. It looked like a wavy haze with flashes of blue.

3. Splitting Heaven and Earth- Qi in the body splits in two directions: one flow going up and one flow going down, on either side of the body.

4. Monk Gazes at the Moon- A lot of Qi on the hands and forearms.

5. Lowering the Head and Hips - Qi goes up one arm above my head and down the other arm hanging down.

6. Touch the Feet with Both Hands- Qi rises up the back in the Governor channel on the way up, and out to the arms in the outer arm channel. Qi goes down the inside arm channel, down the conception channel, down the inner leg channel to the ground on the way down. I like this one best.

7. Clenching the Fists- Qi flows out the outer arm meridian to the fist I'm extending, and then comes back in to the Dantian.

8. Shaking the Body - Didn't really notice anything with this one. I guess my lower back got a little warm.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: icefire on June 23, 2013, 11:23:40 AM
Trying to kick it up a notch. Wuwei meditation for 1 hour on my back then straight to wuji posture holding the ball for 5 mins. I felt energy movement almost everywhere in the body.
Did 18 reps for all movements in wuji, but I had to rest my knees for a seconds between 4.-5. and 6-7.

Some experiences here. I felt something in every move, but it wasn't really that much.

4. monk gazes: centers of the palm strong sensations.
6. touch the feet: wow! it was like I was creating a geyser when I was coming back up and a waterfall when touching the floor. I didn't try to pinpoint where qi was, but back was very active and upper arms.
7. clenching the fists: sensation in hands. It was like I was pushing something out when punching and drawing something in when pulling back.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Koujiryuu on June 23, 2013, 12:40:31 PM
Glad to hear you're very seriously practicing icefire.

Good experiences. I get the same sensation doing "Touching the Feet With Both Hands".
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: jimdare on June 24, 2013, 03:03:55 PM
1. Supporting the Sky with Both Hands

Mild tingling in my hands.

2. Draw a Bow to Each Side (modified Shaolin Archer)

I noticed a weird haze around my hands, but can't be sure that this is not an arifact of eye relaxation.

3. Splitting Heaven and Earth

I really felt my laogong points with this exercise.  This was the first exercise where I really started to feel the tingling sensation.

4. Monk Gazes at the Moon

My hands became very warm.  I could distinctly feel tingles in my middle finger.

5. Lowering the Head and Hips

My lower hand was almost throbbing.

6. Touch the Feet with Both Hands

Not so much with this one.

7. Clenching the Fists

Not so much with this one.

8. Shaking the Body

My lips began to tingle.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Shinichi on June 24, 2013, 06:04:12 PM
I just want to add that I did try Baduanjin in various other ways. Bouncing in and out of wuji, not relaxing the mind properly, leading with movement instead of breath. Just experimenting with different things.

It was all terrible. :P

My advice to everyone who does this practice is this:

1) Experiment. See for your self that some ways work better than others.

2) Relax. If you have a wild monkey mind, stand in wuji for a few minutes at the start and just relax, practicing wuwei or some other form of meditation for a moment.

3) Let breath lead movement. This may sound like a strange concept--not moving, but breathing and following movement. It can seem like a paradox, but it is important. Relax the mind, breath, and let the movement follow the breath. After you memorize the movements and you don't forget what to do, this isn't that hard, so give it a try and practice.

4) Practice!  :P It takes time to memorize the movements, and get the breathing and the relaxation and everything "right." But you'll only "get" it if you practice, so practice!

Have I mentioned that this is probably my favorite practice out of the whole group so far? Because it is.



~:Shin;~
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Koujiryuu on June 24, 2013, 08:14:48 PM
Quote
I just want to add that I did try Baduanjin in various other ways. Bouncing in and out of wuji, not relaxing the mind properly, leading with movement instead of breath. Just experimenting with different things.

It was all terrible. Tongue

My advice to everyone who does this practice is this:

1) Experiment. See for your self that some ways work better than others.

2) Relax. If you have a wild monkey mind, stand in wuji for a few minutes at the start and just relax, practicing wuwei or some other form of meditation for a moment.

3) Let breath lead movement. This may sound like a strange concept--not moving, but breathing and following movement. It can seem like a paradox, but it is important. Relax the mind, breath, and let the movement follow the breath. After you memorize the movements and you don't forget what to do, this isn't that hard, so give it a try and practice.

4) Practice!  Tongue It takes time to memorize the movements, and get the breathing and the relaxation and everything "right." But you'll only "get" it if you practice, so practice!

Have I mentioned that this is probably my favorite practice out of the whole group so far? Because it is.

Great advice.

I will also add that there are two other things of importance. Feeling out your meridians, and not having any preconceptions.

Feeling out your meridians means consciously paying attention to the meridian paths in the body and how Qi manifests in them while practicing these forms. This will benefit you later in circulations such as the Microcosmic Orbit, Macrocosmic Orbit, 5 Gates Breathing, and other circulations that lead Qi through the meridians.

Here's the chart for reference:

(http://s11.postimg.org/yyockboer/mei.jpg)

Governor (Dumei), Conception (Renmei), Through-Going (Chongmei), Belt (Daimei), Outer Arm (Yangyumei), Inner Arm (Yinyumei), Outer Leg (Yangqiaomei), and Inner Leg (Yinqiaomei) are the English references for these. Being able to feel them out and direct Qi in them is a fundamental component of spiritual Qigong.

Having no preconceptions means not letting your mind get attached to the movements, Qi movements you notice, or breath, and also means having no expectation that anything at all will happen while you practice the form. If your mind is unattached and still and centered in Void, you will ultimately be open to anything you experience while doing the form. If you expect or have a preconception that doing a certain form will move Qi in a certain way, then it is likely you will notice that happening. Be still, breathe, and do the exercises without attachment. This way, anything you experience will be real.

I also enjoy these exercises. I made a video of the alternate forms of them here, that are more commonly practiced: http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php/topic,22042.msg215011.html#new

Stick with the version in the study group for the rest of this week, and after that you can try the alternate movements if you wish.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: SMFforumID on June 25, 2013, 12:15:37 PM

These set of exercises have given me the strongest sensations so far. I started to feel the "wispy" sensations around my hands during the splitting the heaven and the earth exercise. But "lowering the head and hips" and "touching the feet with both hands" were much more strong. During "touching the feet with both hands" i felt "the movement of warmth" along my back, shoulders and arms. By the end of the entire set my arms and hands felt "warm and connected". This time these sensations went past my elbows to encompass my entire arms. Also, I felt the warm sensation near the tantien. I'm still working on doing the exercises without using references to the video or to my written notes.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Impervious on June 25, 2013, 03:18:43 PM
1. Supporting the Sky with Both Hands
I noticed qi flowing up and down my arms.

2. Drawring a bow to each side
Nothing really happened for me, with this one.

3.Splitting Heaven and Earth
I felt a bit of tingling on my arms and usually on the hand that was facing toward the sky. I also noticed an occasional tingling in my legs. I didn't notice these sensations on every repetion, and they weren't very strong.

4. Monk Gazes at the Moon
I felt really in the zone with this exercise. I felt a lot of tingling along my hands when I pushed to each side, mainly around the fingers.

5. Lowering the Head and Hips
Again, I was feeling a strong tingling in all of my fingertips throughout this exercise. Whenever I got back into the Holding the Balloon stance, I felt a lot of tingling throughout my body.

6. Touch the Feet with both Hands
When I lifted my arms out to my sides, it felt like qi was flowing along both arms toward my hands. I didn't notice much on the downward motion, but when returning to Wu Qi I felt very energized. I don't know how to describe this. I wasn't feeling any tingling really, but I felt like I was almost on a massive caffeine buzz or something. Very strange.

7. Clenching the Fists
I felt next to nothing with this form.

8. Shaking the Body
Nothing much with this one, either. I did feel tingling on my face and shoulders, but it wasn't much to write home about. EDIT: This tingling could have been influence by jimdare, because I read his experience post around 20 minutes before starting this. To the best of my knowledge, I was keeping a fairly empty mind, but I'm not sure now. :P
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: jimdare on June 25, 2013, 04:42:47 PM
This tingling could have been influence by jimdare, because I read his experience post around 20 minutes before starting this. To the best of my knowledge, I was keeping a fairly empty mind, but I'm not sure now. :P

Haha, I struggle with the same thing.  It's very easy to perceive someone elses suggestions.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: jimdare on June 26, 2013, 01:25:09 PM
I don't know about everyone else, but I'm finding it much easier to feel my 'qi' in everyday life.  The parts I feel the most are my hands, shins, and the back of my neck/head.  I'm looking forward to learning how to use this to influence something external so I can be sure this is not my imagination.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Shadow_Dragon on June 27, 2013, 05:04:45 AM
2. Drawing a bow to each side
I love this one, even though I prefer the horse stance with Shaolin Archer, I still am able to reap the effects quite nicely. I can feel qi moving from my dantian, pulling from my extended arm to my back arm.

3.Splitting Heaven and Earth
This is my favorite one so far. I can feel qi moving up and down, and down my spine. I feel very centered while performing this exercise.

6. Touch the Feet with both Hands
I could feel qi flowing throughout my entire body, especially as I stood up, I could feel it flowing upwards.

7. Clenching the Fists
I like this one a lot. I felt very much in harmony with my surroundings, and I felt qi go to each fist as I "punched".
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: jimdare on June 27, 2013, 01:07:28 PM

3) Let breath lead movement. This may sound like a strange concept--not moving, but breathing and following movement. It can seem like a paradox, but it is important. Relax the mind, breath, and let the movement follow the breath. After you memorize the movements and you don't forget what to do, this isn't that hard, so give it a try and practice.


I found this advice really helpful.  I can now feel my breath 'pulling' parts of my body like magnets.  It's quite a cool, yet strange sensation.   
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Aprophis on June 27, 2013, 02:15:11 PM
Archer:
Tingling and whispy feelings in my thighs

Splitting Heaven & Earth:
tingling and pulling feelings in my middle finger and my thighs. Also tingling in my lagong

Monk Gazes at the moon:
Tingling from middle finger down to lagong, pulling and itching in lagong

Lowering the Head and Hips :
Tingling  in lagong intensifies

Touching the Feet with two hands:
Pulsating feeling of energy flow in my middle fingers when bending down, tingling to lagong intensifies.

Clenching the Fists:
Whispy feelings of energy on my upper thighs front and back.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Shinichi on June 27, 2013, 06:43:55 PM

3) Let breath lead movement. This may sound like a strange concept--not moving, but breathing and following movement. It can seem like a paradox, but it is important. Relax the mind, breath, and let the movement follow the breath. After you memorize the movements and you don't forget what to do, this isn't that hard, so give it a try and practice.


I found this advice really helpful.  I can now feel my breath 'pulling' parts of my body like magnets.  It's quite a cool, yet strange sensation.   

This is good, I believe. Now, pay attention, and you may directly feel and understand the meaning of "Yi leads Qi."  :)



~:Shin:~
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: Nan on June 28, 2013, 03:48:31 AM
I have to admit that I didn't do all of the exercises and the reason for that is that I had a severe case of hay fever although I must note that since starting I often get tingling feeling whenever I breath deeply. They usually happen on my palms and the top of my head and I have felt a lot better physically. I have also required slightly less food and I have noticed that sometimes I quite simply know where a living being is when I should not be able to gain this knowledge provided I am aware that it exists in a rough proximity of about three-four meters in any direction. I have started incorporating short periods of meditation, usually less than a minute at a time, into my ordinary life and am able to enjoy it(my life) more.
Title: Re: Exercise 7: Baduanjin Qigong experiences
Post by: icefire on June 28, 2013, 06:53:46 AM
Good week of training. Finally found the trick of how I do both versions of shaolin archer. I didn't turn my waist enough when I didn't feel anything in archer sometimes, just moved arms too much. Now moving the waist also with the breath made it much better.